Racing at BSCC with "Fuel Management"

Well, I don't entirely disagree with you, I know it has caused me a few frustrating moments.  But I thought they did a much better job last night of at least informing drivers when it was time to pit.  That's been missing on some of the other nights and drivers just drove around losing laps on empty.  I agree it's too much for the driver to be worrying about fuel while trying to drive around a track at an average of about 4 seconds a lap.  At those speeds there's not much time to not pay attention.

I just added a new poll to see what we might be interested in racing for the next Beaverton season.  Perhaps we can do fuel management with the next poll.  I know we'll be using it on the digital system when we race on it.

I think my view on fuel/tire management is fairly well known.  As per instructions on fuel management the experienced racers are to monitor their own while those less experienced are to recieve help.  However, I am having a hard time standing by idlly while someone may be pitching away a nice heat because they forgot to fuel up their electric racecar.  So, I decided to give a reminder to anyone who needed it.  I did get distracted a few times and may have missed some, but others stepped in to help out. This may be contrary to the rules but is more along the lines of friendly competition.

Well, thought I ought to weigh in here since I am the one who implemented the fuel management system at Marshall Field Raceway.

As you all may know, one of the main philosophies of the Beaverton Slot Car Club is to keep up with some of the latest technologies available for 1/32 commercial slot cars and give slot car racers a wide range of experiences with the sport.  Fuel and tire management is one of these technologies.  There are others such as digital, which incorporates fuel management too, but we are not digitial, yet?

Realism is an interesting concept in slot car racing.  We all try to "get" as realistic as possible in this sport, but becoming stuck on some realism's isn't necessary the point.  Simulated realism is more in line with slot cars, not actual realism.  I see it as a blending of actual and simulated realism.  By this I mean, it is realistic to have fuel and tire management of a race car (actual) but not by having the drivers pay attention to fuel and tires (simulated).  Of course, a small debate could be had that back in the old days, drivers did have this situation or in SCCA racing today on an amatuer level they do now too to a certain extent.   But I digress. 

In the world of slot car's, having the capability of fuel and tire management, as I see it, is a plus in expanding the experience of slot car racing.  But it is a change from the norm and like digital slot car racing, the change becomes the toughest part to accept for some.  My son and I at BSCC believe in changing and evolving the experience of slot car racing to whatever the industry has to offer.  Keeping in line with this philosophy, I would have to say I like the fuel and tire management system and think it adds another element of strategy thus enriching the experience of the sport.

When to implement fuel seems to be the real issue.  Most would agree, if they are not opposed to the system to start with, that for an enduro and changing drivers for teams is a great place for fuel and possibly tire management.  That way they have a simulated pit crew in their teammates and can stay on top of the system and thus concentrate on the driving only. 

This in a way works well but does it really give you, as a driver, the added strategy that is built into the system?  Not really, because you don't have to pay attention to the fuel as your pit crew member will do it for you.  So in this sense, why have it?  Except for a handy dandy way to make a driver's change, it seems to defeat the purpose of the fuel management system concept, which is to give the driver a more strategy base racing experience and a multitasking approach to racing slot cars.

To have it at short heats with extremely fast cars is what has generated most of the complaints of the system.  The break in concentration for some racers during racing has proven to be more of a hinderance than an enjoyment.  Would it be better if the cars were slower and the heat times longer?  As an evolving club, this seems to be the next experiment.  I tend to agree that it is difficult for most and is taking away from the enjoyment of slot car racing here at Marshall Field Raceway for such fast cars in short heats. 

The experiment of utilizing fuel management, in my opinion, has proven successfully implemented and time will tell which direction the club members want to go with it in races at Marshall Field Raceway.

Racin' Randy

Hi Bill,
Glad to have a good discussion on this. I think it helps the sport develop. 

Your right of course, that the "new technologies" is not all that new, yet it is new for the particular computer programs that are currently available that we are using.  This is what I was referring to.  You have us newbies at a disadvantage as you have been doing this a lot longer than most of us and thus have seen things that are "new" to us.

My intention is not to discuss the merits of slot cars as "toys" or not.  We have had that one before and fuel management is the talk of the time here.  But a short note on this would suffice nevertheless for others who have not been privy to our thoughts on this.   Compared to scratch built brass chassis with hard bodies and others along those lines, these could be considered "toys".  Compared to cars from sets of yesteryear, they are much more than those "toys".  If you want to call them "toys" then so be it.  But having a collection of hundreds of cars, I would argue more along the line of something more than a "toy".  So they are what they are, much better than yesteryear set cars, not as strong and durable as scratch built or metal chassis types, they break like all cars in the world, yet can last for years of hard racing, and they are a hell of lot of fun to race.  That's all that really matters.

I think keeping in perspective the concept of trying to grow the sport and get more people involved in slot car racing, "new" approaches to racing can have a benefit for racers.  Not all will like new things, but keeping up with the manufacturer's offerings is something we at Beaverton Slot Car Club strives to accomplish.  Things will be added and things will drop off, it is the nature of the world.  Having a positive approach to the "new" things that come out and trying them out is one of our goals as a host.  It is there for those who enjoy it and want to play with it.

As our motto at Beaverton Slot Car Club states, "Just for the Fun of It", we try to live up to that mantra.

Thanks Bill, love the discussion.
Racin' Randy

I think I would agree with Rico there.  There's not really any strategy to how much fuel you should get since it's a three second delay to get fuel at all.  So if I only get a partial fill to save time I will lose time in the long run since every time I stop I have to invoke the three second clause.  It should take less total down time to get one full tank than two half tanks.  So the only strategy is to try and squeeze every lap out of it you can and then get every drop of fuel you can until it comes down to the end of the final heat at which point you can gamble on the amount of fuel you have vs the amount of time left at the final pit stop.  Randy, how long does it take to complete a pit stop if you go from empty to full?

Monte- I'd guess around 8 seconds or 2 laps. Randy can correct me if I'm wrong.
Rico

Hello everyone, what a world of discussion!

Reading the note about strategy, I thought of something to point out.

I agree that the most strategy comes in with your last pit stop.  The strategy in deciding how much fuel to finish off the race, since every time before that you would get a full tank.  You can stay for the 3sec and get a quick shot of fuel, or you can stay a few seconds longer to get a full tank.
    But for the amount of time you lose in the pits it doesn't seem to be worth trying to get just the right amount fuel.  You will only lose about 2 laps to completely fill up your car, and by staying in for a second or two less, you might gain a half a lap or so.  But, by staying in a little less you run the risk of having to pit again because you run out of fuel.  So, you might as well play it safe.  Thus, your strategy won't matter much in the end, unless everyone is within 1 or 2 laps of each other, which is very rare.

However, there could be plenty of strategy when doing a longer enduro. 
Since we control how much fuel is used, based on lap times, and how much fuel you start with, how long it takes to start getting fuel, and how long it takes to completely fill up a tank....  there are lots of possibilities. 
    One example would be that you burn very little fuel when turning an average lap time, like 5sec.  Then if you go faster than, say 4.5sec, you burn a significantly larger amount of fuel.  And if you break under 4sec you use lots and lots of fuel that lap.  This would force people to think about driving conservatively.  You would have the choice to drive "slow and steady" to win the race, or drive as fast as possible to win the race.  This would add a little more realism to enduros, like racecar drivers do in really racing.... you usually see them go really fast to get an early lead, and then they slow down to a steady pace.  When the end of the race gets closer, everyone picks up speed to move up a position or two.

My question to you guys is:
What do you think about experimenting like this for enduros?

Yes your right Bill, sorry.  When I mean commercial, I really do mean retail.

As far as racing for years.  I do have cars that we have been racing hard for years.  The most immediate one that comes to mind is the A1GP cars.  I still race the one I raced last year.  Of the six I have and raced all but one still races like it did last summer.  Of course, when I mean for years I don't literally mean every time there is a race I race these cars. More of a seasonal thing.  In other words, the cars we have raced for a season still are raceable for another season.  Heck I rarely change out the brushes and rarely the motors.  Sure wings and mirrors break off but the cars still run great.  And remember before we had Marshall Field we had the Underground Raceway and Byron and I raced for years 3 or 4 times a week for hours at a time there.

I have heard comments from others too about how they race all season and have never even oiled their cars. 

Now this class we are racing is extreme and the cars take a hell of lot of pounding.  But my Ferrari will still be running strong way past the end of the season.  My other car got trashed pretty good and I have to replace the chassis.  That only cost about $18.  In the 1/24 scale world of Paser, I have seen cars come off thetrack with far more expensive damage.  Heck the tires need replacing almost every race and they aren't cheap.  Not to mention motors, brushes and gears that go out all the time.  So in a comparison with that world, the 1/32 retail stuff holds up pretty damn good, at least in my experience.  And I can only relate my experience to people.  If compared to the amount of race time I have put on these cars and the amount of race time put on 1/24 scale Paser racing, I would have to say I have had really good longivity with the 1/32 scale.  Much less expensive too. 

Just my 2 cents worth of observation.  Maybe I'm just lucky.
Take care,
Racin' Randy

I think I would have to agree with Randy to a certain degree.  1/32 are made of PLASTIC and I am amazed how tough some of them are.  I have seen some tremendous wallops and cars fly airborn clear off the table to the cement below and be put right back on the track.  Some cars are more prone to damage to the periphials (mirrors, wings, etc) but the major bodies remain intact and runnable.  Granted, I know very little about 1/24 hardbody racing, but I have done some 1/24 Flexi and it certainly is easy to damage them.  Maybe a large portion of it has to do with the operator????
Rico

If someone wants to spend oodles of money on slot cars: they can and will no matter what the scale is.  I have seen $100.00+ HO cars and 1/24 motors for $281.00.  Do you have to spend that much money to have a good time?  Of course not, but people do and will continue to do so.  You and I enjoy tweaking our cars to try to make them better which usually leads to more expense for upgraded parts or whatever.  I don't get the idea that Randy does and except for his 300+ car collection, his expense per car is probably less than what you or I might spend.  I think we all know that any scale can be raced relatively cheaply or one can spend cubic dollars to race. I guess it just depends what one is trying to do and there is no right or wrong answer.
Rico