Topic: New Championship Rules for 2016

NASTE Racing Guidelines
and
Championship Series Rules

Goal
To promote long-term participation in local slot car racing by following guidelines that promote fairness and progressive skill development.

Assumptions
People participate in this activity for a variety of reasons. Any effective guideline must have some advantages for everyone, from the competitive scratch builder to the casual social participant. A good policy will be defined by its accepted use over time. Track owners are key to achieving this goal, as they can implement whatever policies or rules that they wish on their own property regardless of any guidelines.


NASTE Racing Guidelines

Race Events

Pre-Race Notice - Track owners will specify car classes, acceptable modifications and any other race requirements or special rules of their race in the posting prior to the race ( e.g., “crash and burn”). Rules and requirements may vary by Division. To be an eligible event for Championship Series points, the words “NASTE sanctioned” must appear in the race notice.

$2 Race Fee - Racers will be charged a fee of $2 to compete at each NASTE race. The fee will be waived for new racers, for their first two races. Children 12 and younger will race for free. (These fees effective January 1, 2007.)

IROC Format - All NASTE Championship Series races will use an IROC format where all racers will race the same cars and controllers. Track owners will position and assign similarly prepared cars in each lane with controllers also assigned and remaining connected to each lane. (In the event of damage to a controller, the owner will be reimbursed for the parts necessary to make the repairs by the NASTE treasurer from NASTE club funds.) Racers will not be allowed to use their own controllers.

Awards – Event trophies, certificates, awards or any other recognition is up to the track owner’s discretion, but is encouraged for the Novice Division.

Results - Scores are kept separately by Division. Race results are posted separately on the NASTE website.

Racers

Division - Racers must declare which Division they will compete in at the beginning of each NASTE event.

  • Novice – Any person may declare and race in the Novice Division. However the intent is for this division to consist of less experienced and new racers. Upon winning two races in the Novice Division, racers must move up into the Intermediate Division for all subsequent NASTE races. A track owner/manager may refuse to recognize novice status to any racer who is obviously not a novice.

  • Intermediate – Any person may declare and race in the Intermediate Division.

  • Expert – Any person may declare and race in the Expert Division.

Corner Marshal – When not racing, racers are expected to take a turn at corner marshalling or otherwise providing support to the event.


Race Event Format

Two Rounds - Each race event will be two Rounds of racing. A Round consists of each racer racing one "Heat Race" on each the track's lanes. "Heat Race" laps and fractions of a lap are totaled to determine finish positions for the Round (i.e., on a four lane track, 1 Round = each racer completing 4 Heat Races, one on each of the track's lanes). To simplify lane rotation, Heat Races will start at the track's Start/Finish line. Fractions of a lap will be scored on a tally sheet, and be added to the racer's lap totals. The heat race length will be determined at each race depending upon the number of entries.

Race Formats - Races will be run in one of three types of race formats.

  • Big NASTE - One format is the “best of two” format NASTE has used for years - the "Big NASTE" format. In this format there are two Rounds of racing with each racer’s best finish of the two rounds determining their overall finish position. Championship Series points will be awarded to each racer based on their overall finish position. Track owners or Race Hosts will decide what format they wish to use.

  • Full Monte - The second available format will be called the “Full Monte”. In this format the two Rounds of racing are completed with two different types of cars. The first round will be raced with one type or style of car, and the second round will be raced with a different type of car. The Rounds will be run and scored in the same manner, but for each Round each racer will have a separate finish position. Simply put, each Round is a separate race. Championship Series points will be awarded to each racer based on their best finish in either Race/Round. In this format it is quite possible for two racers to earn the same amount of Championship Series points at the same race. This is in step with the scoring system NASTE used in the late 90s when racing multiple classes at the same event.

  • Standard - The third format will be referred to as the “Standard” format. In this format the racer’s first and second round lap scores will be combined for a total race score.

Sequence by Division - A race may have racers of all Divisions racing together, but when the Divisions race separately, they will race in the following order:

  • Racing events will begin with the Novice Division race.

  • The Intermediate Division race will follow the Novice race.

  • The Expert Division race will follow the Intermediate race.


Championship Series Rules

NASTE Sanction - The words “NASTE sanctioned” must appear on race notices to earn Championship Series points. Casual, unposted or other races do not.

Declaration - Only racers who declare and pay a $5 fee will compete in the NASTE Championship Series. Racers in any Division are eligible.

Points – Each Championship Series racer’s points will be tracked for the racer’s overall finish position in each race. Overall finish positions are based on the finish scores of all the participating racers in all Divisions. Racers have 30 days to challenge posted event results. After that it’s “too bad”. Current NASTE Championship Series point standings will be posted for all to see on the NASTE website. In addition, each racer will be awarded one half of a lap, .5 for each win they score leading up to the final Shoot Out race. Racers are only elligible for the 1/2 lap bonuses on non-hosted tracks. In other words, racers can only receive the 1/2 lap bonuses on tracks they do not own and operate.

Best 5 - Each Championship Series racer's final points total will be based on the racer’s best 5 race finishes.

Championship Run Off - The final race of the racing season will be the NASTE Championship Run Off. This race will be an all-day event and consist of all the racers that have declared their desire to compete in the series and paid the $5 fee. Racers not in the Championship Series will race for door prizes. The top seven racers in points will compete in the Run Off. The racers below the top seven in points will compete in the Trophy Dash. The race format for the top seven in the point series standings will start with the B Main. The B main will consist of the bottom four of the seven in points. The winner of the B Main will move up to compete in the A Main with the top three in points. The winner of the A Main will be the NASTE champion for the season.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Interesting, but where would the Run Off be held? Sounds like the current NASCAR set-up. You don't have to win a race all year until the last one. A driver could win every race all year leading up to the last one and not be the champion because he didn't win the last one. Ryan Newman almost pulled it off last year. tongue

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Who holds the Run Off and where will be determined at the annual NASTE BBQ, or when I send out the notice for race scheduling to all the track owners. It will be part of the same system I use now to schedule races.

With our current scoring system a driver can win the championship without ever winning a race. In fact I believe I have done that. Some of the differences between the NASCAR system and this one are; only a racers best 5 races count towards their final total score. Only the top 3 are guaranteed a spot in the final A Main race. If I use last season's results as an example, the 7 racers in the shout Out would have been; Terry 97 points, Bill 96, Tracy 98, Monte 99, Rico 94, Dave Smith 98, and Flyin' Bryan with 99 points. Flyin' Bryan, Monte, and Dave Smith would have had the 3 spots in the A Main, with Dave's four wins to Tracy's three breaking that tie. Based on that example, I am quite confident that any one of those racers in the top seven, would be very representative of a NASTE championship driver. Any one of those drivers is capable of winning a race at any of our venues. I really doubt a racer will be able to make it into the top seven without winning at least one race during the regular season, but maybe it will happen. At least with the new system the driver that wins the series championship will have to win at least one race!

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

2016 will be NASTE's 20th consecutive year of Point Series Championship racing. Over the years NASTE has evolved into one of the most diverse slot car racing clubs I have ever been associated with. We have racers with all levels of ineterest in slot racing, from hard core builders and racers to those with just casual interest just racing for the fun of it and the social interaction. That is what has made NASTE so successful and in my mind one of the best slot car clubs around! However, it has become quite a challenge to design a racing format that suits everyones interest. I am quite confident this new format will help make our racing for the 2016 season more FUN for everyone! If you're not interested in racing in the championship series, well you're not in it unless you choose to be. It will be each racers option and decission as to which group of racers and experience level they race with. If you're a new racer or less experienced, but you'd still like to take part in the championship series just to see how you stack up, well you can do that while still racing with other racers at your same skill level. The biggest difference between NASTE's new race format and NASCAR is we do this for FUN, not for millions of dollars!

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Hopefully not an HO track. 

Millions?  Oh yes, putting on a race is quite the money making opportunity.  We should get Bernie involved.

roll

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

kidvolt wrote:

Hopefully not an HO track. 

Millions?  Oh yes, putting on a race is quite the money making opportunity.  We should get Bernie involved.

roll

I'll second that!!!!

Race cars are neither beautiful nor ugly. They become beautiful when they win.

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Read the new rules Bill and Monte. Thank you. Congrats on 20 years of racing.

Monte, Who's Bernie?

And why would you say hopefully not an HO track? Are not all tracks going to be considered when it comes to choosing who gets to host the most prestigious race of the NASTE season?

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

We are lucky in that I see three possibilities for the Shoot Out venues where the home court advantage is pretty much eliminated. My first choice would be to ask Howie to host the Shoot Out race at Rapid Raceway. Howie typically does not participate in enogh NASTE races to be eligible for the Shoot Out. I would race the NASTE '55 Chevys, which are the roots of the NASTE organization. The BRM Porsche 962s would also be a good choice for the Shoot Out at Rapid Raceway. Another potential host track with no home court advantage would be The Gorge Raceway. Again Bob Nakamura typically does not run the full season with NASTE. Lastly we have the option of the race being held at TooBad Motorplex. What lessens the home court advantage there is the fact that there are routinely scheduled races throughout the year where racers can get experience and practice on the track. But the real breaker would be the fact I would run the Shoot Out with the track running direction reversed. We have only had one race on TooBad in the reverse direction, and I do not plan on holding any races with the direction reversed, except for the possibility of the 2016 Season Shoot Out.

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

smile I was fixing dinner and thinking about it Bill and was just going to suggest that maybe someone not in the race for the chase could host. You thought of it first though!

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Bernie Ecclestone is the chief executive of Formula One.  He thinks he's a big deal.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

I'm sure I think about this stuff way too much, and I'm sure Diane would agree with that. I just want everyone with any interest at all, to have a venue to have a good time racing slot cars. I truly believe slot car racing is one of the best hobbies around!

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Formula One. Isn't that where a group of race cars parade around a track in single formation and the top qualifier gets the trophy? What kind of decisions does Bernie make? How many laps the parade should be? tongue

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

So why not an HO track I hear you ask? 

Because HO is a more acquired skill than the others and therefore represents the least fair option to the general populace.

Let me show you some numbers to illustrate the actual impact of the "TRACK OWNER".  Here are the compiled results of all the races for the last 7 years hosted by the major players.  Let's see how this actually breaks out:


http://www.naste.org/members/monte/Reality.jpg


As you can see from the information Bill's track is the least likely to reward the track owner while Bryan's is just about a sure bet.  Of the other 6 HO races, 3 were won by the "track owner" while two of the others were won by Bryan and Dave Smith - racers with great amounts of HO skill.

You can also see that the HO track owners have a far greater win rate vs. the other scales.

I believe this points out Bill's track as the best choice.  With the advent of the Thursday night series he's been offering most of us are quite familiar with the track reducing any advantage the track owner would have which the results clearly show.

Just the fact's ma'am.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Thank you Monte for the fact filled and enlightening post, it is much appreciated.

Rico

Race cars are neither beautiful nor ugly. They become beautiful when they win.

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Thanks Monte. It's nice to have this kind of data to help resolve issues.

16 (edited by Dorothy the Hammer February 24, 2015 2:24 pm)

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Thanks Monte. smile Don't know Bernie, but according to him I guess I should. lol

Thanks too for the information. That gives me a reasonable answer and it is good to see it broken down.

Also, if you are taking just the top five finishes for racers to be included into this new championship finale, does that mean the team races will NOT count? It seems like it might be an advantage or disadvantage for some people depending on which team they get included on. Just curious.

Backwards on Bill's track would be a good choice and also Howie's and Bob's like Bill was mentioning. All of those tracks are fun to race on even for us non competitors.

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

I don't know...  All I see in that so-called "data" Monte showed is that Bill can't win a race.  Even at his own track.

(Come on, you know you were ALL thinking it!)

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

An Enduro/Team event could be scheduled without being sanctioned.  It is possible not all events would be sanctioned, the Halloween event for example.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Chris, "so-called"?  We'll both smack you.  ;-0

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

kidvolt wrote:

Chris, "so-called"?  We'll both smack you.  ;-0

Can I help? Pretty pleeeeease!

Race cars are neither beautiful nor ugly. They become beautiful when they win.

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

"So called" data is right. Anybody can skew numbers to their advantage. I flipped back through some results and saw only two times at Rico's track where the winner was not Rico (owner), A.J. (resident) or Monte (builder). That means you are less likely to win there unless you are one of those three guys. Bryan's place is the only one where the track owner dominates. Monte has a better chance of winning at home than I do.

As for "acquired skill". when I started racing with NASTE all the races were either HO or 1/24th Econo cars. I've had to learn every scale and every track by showing up and getting beat, sometimes badly. I know that now I can challenge at most tracks, but the track owner will always have an advantage if the track is only used for one or two races a year.

I just added up the numbers and they said I need another rum ball or three. tongue

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

ckouba wrote:

I don't know...  All I see in that so-called "data" Monte showed is that Bill can't win a race.  Even at his own track.

(Come on, you know you were ALL thinking it!)

Sad...........but true.............

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

I'm sorry, I got lost.  Exactly who did I benefit with my "skewed numbers" and my suggestion that Bill's track was a good solution?  And the list of apparently skewed numbers was to compare wins by track owner, not the track owner, his immediate family (uh let's see, John Bostic, AJ Locati, Amanda Abbott) or personal friends.

So here we are trying to find a good solution that everyone can live with.  Bill has come up with a good plan that will offer reasonable and fair competition for all.  It also allows those that don't feel they have the right moxie to not have to compete for the championship but rather just race for the fun of it.

If someone has a better plan then let's hear it.  We've certainly heard enough complaints about the current one.  Speak up.  Be clear.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

And one other item to consider for fairness...  The track owner wins most of the time.  ALWAYS!

Find a solution that makes it equally fair for the racer that doesn't own a track and host races.  Otherwise why should I even want to race in a system that clearly rewards those that are track owners that host?

In my opinion, a reduced number of counting events with more opportunities to improve the count gives more people a better chance to get to the final and win the championship, but that's just me.

And there is one more option I have considered bringing up.

Don't let the host(s) race. 

And I'm fine with that rule.  It's fair.  And it would simplify a lot of things.

"Big Smooth"

Re: New Championship Rules for 2016

Thanks Monte for your support. Through the years NASTE has raced under varying race formats. We have tried different things with some working and some not. Systems that have not worked well have been either modified or dropped all together. The changes have come in part to better accommodate the competitors. Things like budget concerns and interest level are major determining factors as to race format. These changing conditions are one reason NASTE has evolved into an IROC style racing series. Slot car clubs come and go, NASTE has been around for over 19 years and our racing and attendance is better than ever. We are doing something right. We have a friendly atmosphere where new racers feel comfortable. We have a relaxed attitude regarding good close competition. We have a point series championship for those that take their racing more serious. We are an excellent venue for all types of slot car enthusiasts! There are other clubs that take the racing much more seriously, and there is nothing wrong with that. I race with other clubs because I also like to race at a more serious level sometimes. Just because someone takes their racing more seriously or shows a higher level of racing skill, does not mean they are doing it wrong, and they should not be ridiculed for it. This new format, whether you like it or not, WILL better serve our wide variety of racers, from casual racer to hard competitor. The bottom line is; if you look around at our races we are ALL there for the fun of it. Our interpretations of fun are as diverse as our racers.